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Discussion/Meta Carol: Breaking down & potentially leaving the group? [Speculation]

Discussion in '6x13: The Same Boat' started by Doctor Grimes, Mar 13, 2016.

  1. thesamurai

    thesamurai The World Is Ours
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    Maybe because he didn't have to do it, since his life wasn't in danger? And also the Wolves burned people out of pleasure, while she didn't.

    Personally I dgaf that Rick killed the dude - just explaining what Carol thought probably.
     
  2. WalkerVoodoo

    WalkerVoodoo Michonne's Shadow
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    Nope Rick absolutely had to. He wasn't going to take an enemy back to the ASZ.
     
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  3. SevenStars

    SevenStars Awaiting Job from Deanna

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    Carol knows Rick had to do it because she knows that there are still Negan and his people out there since they were waiting on them. So Carol most know if Rick had let that guy live, he would have been running to Negan to tell him about Rick's group.

    So, Carol might not like it but she knows that was the best option Rick had.
     
  4. thesamurai

    thesamurai The World Is Ours
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    I meant in terms like he wasn't in any physical danger from the dude at the moment he put a bullet through the dude's skull. But IA, it was the only option to take cause Rick wasn't going to let an enemy live.

    And I don't know why people are so shocked by it. Have they not been watching the show for the past five seasons now.
     
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  5. thesamurai

    thesamurai The World Is Ours
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    Maybe she did understand, then I don't really understand why the slow mo on her face? Like to show she was opposed to it? Was it to make it more dramatic to show her still present PTSD? Idk Maybe I interpreted it wrong.
     
  6. Doctor Grimes

    Doctor Grimes Not Your Governor
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    I don't know if Carol was necessarily opposed to Rick killing Primo, but I think the killing, killing, killing is getting to her mentally. Just like one can be not opposed to autopsies, but could get burnt out performing them day in and day out.
     
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  7. cgomes

    cgomes Ricktator

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    Well, I think Morgan's philosophy is really affecting her state of mind, but also because it's making her rethink everything she's done. She clearly doesn't like it, she doesn't want to kill. Like Rosita told her last episode, they don't like it, but it has to be done. However, Carol just can't see things this way right now. It's not making her feel good about herself, she needs some heal, she needs a balance. She's too depressed and can't stop thinking about how much killing has made her change, has made her become someone she doesn't recognize anymore, someone she doesn't like to be, she might be thinking she's gone too far. I don't know. I can see her distancing herself from the group, not exactly because she doesn't agree with their way of solving problems, but, first of all, because she doesn't want that for herself. Again, I have to say, I feel sorry for Carol.
     
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  8. DirtieBirdie

    DirtieBirdie Awaiting Job from Deanna

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    Right. I don't think she was singling out Rick's actions, but it was yet one more death that she witnessed and was a part of. Which leads me back to my theory that she stayed behind with Maggie not only to protect her but to protect herself from having to do the dirty deed of killing people in their sleep. I think she would have had a breakdown in that complex and perhaps gotten herself killed. We saw how reluctant she was to kill Paula.

    And if people think Rick is evil then they are clueless. Rick feels remorse. He protects his family. He loves deeply. He knows there's a line that is close to being crossed but he hasn't crossed it. At no point has he taken pleasure from the death of another human being. That's what separates him from the governor, Gareth, Joe, etc.

    And anyone who has gone through what that man has would be all sorts of screwed up. Rick, for all of his visits to crazy town, has held together surprisingly well. So have most of team family. They are still good people, despite what a lot of viewers are saying.
     
  9. gwimmy

    gwimmy Walker Bait

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    For me, it seems that Rick goes through the same emotions of not wanting to take human life, then determination, then actually pulling the trigger and dealing with the regret that the others do, but he cycles through those emotions very quickly. When he ripped out the Claimer's throat, then had the convo with Daryl the next morning, that was him accepting who he is, what he has to do, and who he's doing it for (his family). We saw it last week when he killed the guy in his sleep - he showed very similar emotions to Glenn, but more quickly and with a lot less obvious angst. And again this week when he pulled the trigger on not-Negan. He said his apologies as he was pulling the trigger and took no joy in it. That's Rick. He's accepted what he has to do and why and it allows him to act very quickly.

    For Carol - I think until this back half of the season, she and most of the audience believed she had accepted the things she's had to do, too. But given some down-time, we see now that she compartmentalized the violence instead of dealing with it. She took the Suzy-Homemaker act and tried to turn it into something real. Confronted with the need to do violence again, she hesitated, but she got the job done. Seeing Rick right afterward make that decision to kill with no hesitation - We won't know how to read her reaction unless she gets some dialogue about it coming up, but I think it's possible she was sickened by the necessity and taken aback by the quickness of Rick's decision after she'd just hesitated to kill. In the moment, it might make her look at him differently, or look at herself differently.

    The truth is, Carol didn't have to go on this mission. Given her history, I can see how it was expected but plenty of people stayed behind in Alexandria. And now that she knows how hard it was for her, maybe Carol can reconsider her options for next time. I was a little frustrated by her hesitation last night, but I'm glad she's not Terminator-Carol anymore.
     
  10. tuswig

    tuswig Bitch Slayer

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    Perhaps this has been mentioned already but has anyone brought up that at the end of the episode when Daryl asked Carol if she was ok, for the very time she said "No" --- unlike her usual response of "Gotta be"??? I know that Daryl showing physical affection towards Carol in that moment blinded some from this but all that shipping stuff aside, Carol is crying out for help and I don't think Daryl is going to know how to help her...because all he could do was just to hug her as if that would make everything better, and while I appreciate the sentiment, Carol needs alot more than just a hug right now. The same goes for Tobin as well, a kiss is nice but it won't erase everything that has and seems to be continuing to happen to Carol. Carol is not well and I find it a bit disheartening to go on social media and see that people aren't really talking about that as much as they're talking about Caryl or how badass Carol is. I don't ship Caryl but if I did, I would want Carol to be mentally and emotionally healthy before entering into any type of relationship, just like I wanted Michonne to not get involved romantically with Not!Rick!, because he was still battling alot of his demons in 5B/6A. Carol is transforming once again, which makes me really believe that she will be successful this time in leaving the TF and go to The Kingdom with Morgan.
     
  11. Doctor Grimes

    Doctor Grimes Not Your Governor
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    I think Tobin is representative of Carol's tether to Alexandria at this point. He epitomizes the life there. My feeling is once he dies (or something bad happens to him), then Carol will leave.

    Not to say Carol doesn't love her family, but I do think she's getting burnt out on being their guardian -- being forced to do things she'd rather not do -- and I think there's so much water under the bridge there it's beginning to drown her.

    One of the recurrent themes with Carol was the "fresh start", and I think she really needs one. A complete one. With new faces, a new location, etc. Which is why I am convinced she'll be going to the Kingdom.
     
  12. day dreamer

    day dreamer Awaiting Job from Deanna

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    Tobin is like a bandaid distraction for Carol. I don't think his death (if he dies) would prompt her to leave. I'm hoping the distraction she has with Tobin goes along the lines of comic Andrea/Spencer, which Andrea realizing that Spencer is a coward and ending it (hopefully in 615) But I think what's going to make Carol want to leave eventually will be AOW. She'll lose someone close to her via Lucille, and then TF are going to have to be pretty ruthless to the Saviors after that. When all that's said and done, I think maybe that's where she steps away. I hope she's able to at least get everything off her chest long before that, so she's not miserable for an entire season again.