1. Welcome to Tell It to the Dead. We're a discussion forum for AMC's The Walking Dead. Please don't hesitate to ping staff with any questions or concerns. Have fun and watch out for walkers!
    Dismiss Notice

Rick and Morgan's conversation

Discussion in '6x15: East' started by ReeciePiecey, Mar 28, 2016.

  1. ReeciePiecey

    ReeciePiecey Nestled in Rick's Beard
    Patron

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2016
    Messages:
    369
    Likes Received:
    1,787
    Walker Pets:
    93
    Can someone with much better reasoning skills than myself help me better understand the nuances of this conversation? I was confused about Morgan's point. Initially he says he understand that his way isn't necessarily right but then he seems to forget this and try to convince Rick to adapt a similar view.

    I was left confused on many issues such as does he blame Rick for Carol's issues, why he sent Rick home, if he wanted to return to ASZ, if he wanted to leave ASZ. I just couldn't understand his goal.

    Anyone have a better understanding of these scenes?
     
    Doctor Grimes likes this.
  2. Doctor Grimes

    Doctor Grimes Not Your Governor
    Staff Member Admin

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2016
    Messages:
    9,905
    Likes Received:
    52,786
    Walker Pets:
    113
    Location:
    Bottom of the trash can
    Custom Banner
    I believe Morgan is beginning to slowly acknowledge his way isn't always the right way, but feels he understands now what Carol is going through much more. So perhaps he feels better equipped to handle her; he sent Rick home because Rick has other people he needs to look out for as well (Carl, Judy, Michonne).

    Morgan exposed to Rick that what happened with the Wolf only reinforced his view that all life is precious -- as the Wolf saved Denise, but I think he also sees his actions have put others at risk (the entire attack on the ASZ, which he admitted he saw those Wolves before).

    I'll go back over the convo soon and see if I can't parse out more sense.
     
  3. lanielove

    lanielove Nestled in Rick's Beard
    Patron

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2016
    Messages:
    334
    Likes Received:
    1,112
    Walker Pets:
    93
    I really enjoyed that conversation between Rick and Morgan. It was definitely necessary, Morgan and Rick needed to decide if their different philosyphies we going to be the end of their friendship or not.
    I don't believe that either one of them want to end this long standing friendship so with the two of them taking the time to explain each others view helped to clear a lot of the tension that had been between them since the beginning of the season.
    What the two of them have come to realize is that both of their views are too polar opposite of one another, Morgan realizes that his edict of "all life is precious" as much as he wants to live by that; and after seeing what went down with Carol and the Saviors, he knows that that's not a reasonable choice or lifestyle given the world that they are currently living in.
    And Rick is starting to see a glimmer of what Morgan's talking about , (perhaps butterfly effect wise) that killing is necessary but perhaps not all the time.

    The sad thing is that Morgan told Rick in the car something to the effect that indeed the law of averages will catch up with what Rick's set in to motions by killing so many Saviors and Morgan believes that the end result will not turn out good for Rick or the group.
     
  4. lovingdead

    lovingdead The New Mrs. Grimes

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2016
    Messages:
    2,903
    Likes Received:
    13,699
    Walker Pets:
    113
    Location:
    Brooklyn
    I'm glad they had this talk. Honestly, when Morgan confessed that he allowed the Wolf in, I thought Rick was going to lash out. But I see his respect for Morgan is stronger than that and he was willing to hear him out. I do not think either changed the other's mind, but they had a moment of empathizing with the other. Also, I think Morgan sees the changes in Rick, perhaps more than any of the others because he encountered him from the beginning. He sees that Rick is more ruthless, but also more hopeful with Michonne in his life. It was a good touch base for him to see exactly what is going on with Rick since he knows he has been in flux. I think both will ponder what the other said and in the future will meet more in the middle. Also, by Morgan building that jail cell he is opening the door to an alternative to vigilante justice. It is ironic since Rick was in law enforcement, but is now lawless. Will he eventually give into Morgan's suggestion?
     
  5. TakemetoRick

    TakemetoRick Caressing Eugene's Mullet

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2016
    Messages:
    282
    Likes Received:
    1,465
    Walker Pets:
    93
    Location:
    North America
    I felt that Rick took what Morgan had to say to heart, especially regarding the idea that people can change, he just isn't at the point yet that he can embrace it fully. Rather than simply eliminate all threats preemptively, I think Rick will have to find a way to live in this new world without killing, otherwise the price of living will be too high. Which is essentially, the problem Carol is having. Morgan is saying that under the circumstances they've all been dealing with it's understandable that they would shoot first and ask questions later, and it's not wrong. But to make it long term they need to do the hard, psychological work of coming back from that to a more normal way of dealing with threats and conflict. Reestablish the rule of law, etc.
     
  6. ReeciePiecey

    ReeciePiecey Nestled in Rick's Beard
    Patron

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2016
    Messages:
    369
    Likes Received:
    1,787
    Walker Pets:
    93
    Thank you all for your responses. It helps me to get a better sense of were Morgan was coming from. I think I'll have to go back and rewatch when I'm calm after this season is over.
     
    #6 ReeciePiecey, Mar 28, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2016
  7. lovingdead

    lovingdead The New Mrs. Grimes

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2016
    Messages:
    2,903
    Likes Received:
    13,699
    Walker Pets:
    113
    Location:
    Brooklyn
    Very well timed conversation considering their preemptive strike against the Saviors and what it is costing them at the moment. The thing is Morgan is so extreme. I mean how realistic is it? Think if Rick had not killed anyone in just the last two years? He wouldn't be here. I think what Morgan is saying is a goal for the future, but it doesn't work 100% right now and their isn't enough support for it. It's still the Wild Wild West. I like his sentiment though because I would love to see the day that they aren't all amped up for battle.
     
  8. TakemetoRick

    TakemetoRick Caressing Eugene's Mullet

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2016
    Messages:
    282
    Likes Received:
    1,465
    Walker Pets:
    93
    Location:
    North America
    ^ Yes, I agree. I don't think Morgan is really saying that all killing is wrong. Or even second-guessing what Rick has lived through. But they need to find a better way going forward because the path they are on isn't sustainable. I honestly think many of them are realizing that.
     
    ReeciePiecey and lovingdead like this.
  9. lovingdead

    lovingdead The New Mrs. Grimes

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2016
    Messages:
    2,903
    Likes Received:
    13,699
    Walker Pets:
    113
    Location:
    Brooklyn
    The question is how much bigger is this New World they are going to encounter/rebuild? They have only met two peaceful groups so far, but both groups have been victimized. How do you combat that without violence? I mean they can barely feed themselves without fighting. I am glad we are coming to this point in the story because the pendulum has to start swinging the other direction towards civilization and sustainability. But who even knows what is going on in the rest of the world. They could totally one day make it happen in their neck of the woods only to have outside forces try to raid from another corner of America. It is going to take some epic diplomacy and planning.
     
    ReeciePiecey likes this.