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Article The Walking Dead Still a Hit

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by lovingdead, Dec 28, 2016.

  1. lovingdead

    lovingdead The New Mrs. Grimes

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  2. Doctor Grimes

    Doctor Grimes Not Your Governor
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    :lol: I keep saying this as well. The sinking ratings are a definite concern, but the critics acting like it's about to be put out to pasture or is "failing" is hilarious hyperbole. The show is still an incredible monster hit, and what's more? Ratings are down for almost every other show as well.

    Critics have turned on the show (and that's fine, I have my own issues with the show as well), but their exaggeration of the ratings issue is just sad since it has little objectivity to it.
     
  3. Lilly965

    Lilly965 Wig Shopping For Michonne
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    True Doc, but the critics turning on it kinda closes the door for Andy ever receiving an award for Rick Grimes now which is sad. I know he doesn't care but still sad.
     
  4. MsAntiSocial

    MsAntiSocial Watchtower Sniper

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    The hope that any of the actors would get nominated died a few seasons ago, and I think you can blame the writers and executives on the show for that.
     
  5. TakemetoRick

    TakemetoRick Caressing Eugene's Mullet

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    He's so deserving, but I think the ship sailed on that a long time ago. Horror and sci-fi shows never get no Emmy love.
     
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  6. Lennykae

    Lennykae Scott Gimple is the Janet Evanovich of TV.
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    Tati Maslany has been nominated twice and just won for Orphan Black, so genre shows get noticed sometimes. It's mostly the writing that kills TWD's chances moreso than its genre.
     
    #6 Lennykae, Dec 28, 2016
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2016
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  7. tuswig

    tuswig Bitch Slayer
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    Exactly. GoT is a genre show, and they get nominated for awards all the time. AHS has also been nominated for major awards. Look at WestWorld! Please stop saying that due to genre TWD gets ignored by the Emmys, Golden Globes, SAGs, etc...the writing and quality (outside of the zombie effects) are just...well bad; they simply don't deserve it. Even at the height of my love for this show, I never thought it was award worthy outside of AL's acting, and even then I recognized that the show's writing limited its appeal to the critics and voters.
     
  8. Doctor Grimes

    Doctor Grimes Not Your Governor
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    I agree. Maybe genre would've been a wall a decade ago, but the times have changed. Genre is more acceptable now -- and it doesn't hold shows back from garnering awards. TWD's shortcoming has been, and probably will always be, its writing (whether that's because of the writers just not being a high enough caliber -- or whether it's AMC's doing).

    However, I will throw out that I don't like the Emmys (and most award shows) anyway. I do think for the most part it is a sample of what is considered "good", but the way they select shows is not good enough IMHO (they base it off of 1-2 episodes and a couple submitted scenes -- not the work as a whole). Plus there's some definite entrenched favoritism with the Emmy voters. (None of those things affect TWD though -- however I do think they prevent definite worthwhile quality shows from getting recognized.)
     
  9. Butler36

    Butler36 What?
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    Honestly it really isn't the writing. I've seen writing suck eggs and an actor still win an Emmy. The reason TWD doesn't win anything is because it has 4 things working against it.

    1) It is based in Georgia and not LA or NY which is notorious for where Emmy voters are.
    2) Andrew doesn't glad handle in LA or NY and tends to keep to himself so there goes your Emmy votes.
    3) AMC is too cheap to pay to play for an Emmy which is a necessity to winning one.
    4) It's a horror genre so the Emmy's can't pretend it is a Gothic piece (Game of Thrones) or intelligent sci-fi (Orphan Black)

    Emmy's are partially about talent. The rest is bribes, glad handling, and just straight up sucking up. AMC was willing to do that with Mad Men and Breaking Bad (but truth is it was more of their own production companies that basically did it for them) and again Bryan Cranston and to some extent Jon Hamm played the LA/NYC game but Andy? Andy who is on a first class to London as soon as the show wraps? Doubt it.

    Adam Ruins Everything pretty much did a good job of exposing all this stuff (including the Oscars). Emmys aren't really worth the award they give out. It's nice. But money pretty much buys it.

     
  10. Doctor Grimes

    Doctor Grimes Not Your Governor
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    You said so much of what I wanted to say. Yes. The Emmys are just not a good award to me anymore -- a lot of the behind-the-scenes wheeling-and-dealing has been exposed about it over the years. The selection process, the voter bias, etc.

    I do think TWD has writing issues that other shows aren't suffering from at the moment, but I do agree I have seen actors win with horrid dialogue before -- so that is rarely something that holds people back from a good performance (or a wad of cash).

    TWD just isn't an award-bait show. Its stance as a "good" show remains subjective. Personally, I can think of many shows that are certainly what I would call "better" (in production, writing, story, etc.), but TWD is where my heart lies for some reason -- so it has to be doing something right.
     
  11. Butler36

    Butler36 What?
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    HBO wanted GOT to be taken seriously so they painted the town with money and got awards. Ditto with Orphan Black and BBC America. Simple as that. AMC has always been cheap about this show and that extends to not only the quality of writers but also to them spending money on the show to give it prestige. TWD has been its biggest money maker but they treat it like a ugly stepchild that knows how to spin gold.

    I've seen head scratches win Emmys while others (the genuinely brilliant Wire) never won any Emmys and most critics agree it is one of the best television shows ever made. The reason they never won? They were in Baltimore and not in the LA/NYC circles so not a lot of momentum.

    Andy is definitely Emmy worthy but he'll never get it for multiple reasons. Writing is probably the last on the list unfortunately.
     
  12. tuswig

    tuswig Bitch Slayer
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    I take this article with a grain of salt because clearly it was written by a super fan who thinks that high ratings somehow equals quality. This article screams "LOOK AT THE RATINGS, THIS SHOW IS STILL GOOD! FU CRITICS!" No one can argue that TWD ratings aren't still through the roof compared to other shows HOWEVER that still doesn't change the fact that current ratings have not been this low since season 3 and that there has been a 6-7 million drop in viewers since 7.01. That is a fact and it doesn't bode well for the show at all. I do think that some critics (and viewers) act as if this will be the last season of the show because of the ratings drop and I agree, that is a severe exaggeration; however, AMC will continue to run this show into ground and I do believe the ratings will continue to suffer in long run.

    The criticism of The Walking Dead actually started with the cliffhanger at the end of Season 6. Some fans were very unhappy that they had to wait through the summer hiatus to find out who Negan killed.
    Criticism of this show started long before season 6 but dumpster-gate was the turning point for a lot of people and no, it was not just "some" fans who were unhappy, it was MILLIONS of fans and viewers. The cliffhanger was cheap and minimized the impact of Glenn and Abe's deaths (Abe's especially).

    Then critics were very upset by the bloody deaths of Glenn and Abe in the season premiere. It was rough for fans, who are emotionally invested in these characters, to see characters they love brutalized. But it certainly wasn’t a surprise to anyone who has watched the show before that the world of The Walking Dead is violent. And sometimes pretty gory.
    I really think viewers being upset by the gore and brutality of Abe and Glenn's deaths is an exaggeration. From what I have seen people thought that their deaths felt cheap and was for shock value (especially due to the cliffhanger). If you have been watching this show from the beginning, I don't think you can be that put off by blood and gore, at the very least, you become desensitized to it. Also, in my opinion, the slashing of throats in Terminus was a lot worse.

    The Walking Dead Season 7A had a very different emotional tone than past seasons have had. The story is changing. The threat is changing from walkers to people. And transitional periods can be tough.
    Hmmmm...this show has been exploring the human threat over walkers since season 2 (starting with Rick, Hershel and Glenn's run in with the guys at the bar) If the Negan/Saviors threat is a transitional period where new territory is being explored then what was the conflicts with Shane, the prisoners, the Governor, Joe and the "claimers", Terminus, the Wolves, etc????

    Heading into The Walking Dead Season 7B there is a growing sense of hope and optimism as Rick and the group band together to rise up and fight Negan and the Saviors. Sorry critics, but The Walking Dead Season 7 isn’t a failure, and it’s just getting started
    This show always explores the themes of unity, hope, optimism, new beginnings etc. This is nothing new. It takes half of a season for a show to really get started??? People really have that kind of time to waste on watching 8 episodes just for the show to really get started??? LMAO....OK whatever you say. This article is bogus, no one never said that the TWD ratings are bad by tv standards, but the numbers don't lie, ratings are dropping, and it's not just because of the "big, bad meanie critics"
     
    #12 tuswig, Dec 28, 2016
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2016
  13. Barbarossa-TWD

    Barbarossa-TWD Ricktator

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    I was coming over to say just this. Particularly AMC is too cheap to "pay to play".
    The show runners of Mad Men Matthew Weiner and Breaking Bad Vince Gilligan are Hollywood heavy hitters as was the former TWD show runner Frank Darabont

    I think that Andrew is receiving the blow back from the awful way that AMC treated and cheated Frank Darabont. They are not about to reward AGAIN such reprehensible behaviour particularly since it has become a pattern with AMC. I remember when they also pulled the funding for Mad Men but since Weiner created it and wrote it they couldn't fire him. However with TWD, since it was written by Kirkman they could by pass Darabount.
     
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  14. Doctor Grimes

    Doctor Grimes Not Your Governor
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    I think it's also because AMC actually *owns* TWD. Mad Men and Breaking Bad weren't AMC properties. Meaning: if Mad Men and Breaking Bad wanted to say "Fuck you, AMC, we're going elsewhere" they had that leverage.

    TWD doesn't have that opportunity. They literally can't pull away. So they have nothing to threaten with either.
     
  15. Silas

    Silas Beloved Side Piece
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    If TWD's current ratings were their highest ratings, yes, this show would be a beast. The ratings still are spectacular...for another show. But not for TWD. It would be like if Gordon Ramsey suddenly turned out a great fried bologna sammich. Might be better than mine, but still utter shit compared to what he usually cooks. Their ratings aren't fine for them, it's trouble, and likely a downward trend. I'll shit and fall back in it if they start to meet their highest ratings again, on a regular basis.

    I agree with @tuswig. This article was written by someone who probably loves everything AMC throws at them.

    Now will AMC cancel the show tomorrow? Absolutely not. It's still their highest rated show and brings in that $$$. But to deny this could spell trouble for the long run is just plain 'ole denial.

    As for awards...I give no craps at the end of the day. Andy deserves one, sure, but most award-winning shows/movies usually aren't that good so I won't sweat it. Let them keep their awards.
     
  16. TakemetoRick

    TakemetoRick Caressing Eugene's Mullet

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    I'm so glad to finally hear that she won something. She's freakin' amazing.
     
  17. Barbarossa-TWD

    Barbarossa-TWD Ricktator

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    Yes, Darabount adapted Kirkman's GN where as Weiner and Gilligan created and owned their original material.
    My point was that AMC killed it's ties with Hollywood when they got rid of Darabount to AL misfortune.

    They already had a horrible reputation after Mad Men and the stunt they pulled on Darabount did AL no favours. Remember there was almost a two year delay between seasons because Weiner wouldn't put up with AMC's crap... and refused to write the next season, until they restored his budget.
     
  18. TakemetoRick

    TakemetoRick Caressing Eugene's Mullet

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    Over the years, the shows that I've liked the most have had compelling protagonists with emotionally satisfying character arcs that are expertly interwoven with the plot. Usually they end up being genre shows of one type or another. IMO, those shows tend not to be as popular with mainstream audiences, because they often require more complicated plots that take time to build across multiple episodes and seasons, and network tv shows like to have straight-forward, accessible, stand-alone episodes so that anyone can "get into" the show at any time. Sometimes I get lucky with a show like TWD or GoT that receives praise from critics and achieves mainstream popularity (and some award nominations occasionally), but that isn't usually the case. It feels more like the exception rather than the rule.

    In addition to the show-business connection and promotion side of things, I think a lot of award show success is about popularity and not necessarily the quality of the writing. I mean there are tons of really popular network tv drama shows that have been running for years with a kind of formulaic and predictable style that I personally find boring as hell, but millions of people love those shows and their leads get nominated for Emmys left and right. I know that TWD is not perfect from a writing perspective, but I'm invested in the protagonist (Rick) and what happens to him, so I keep watching for that reason. Now, maybe Frank Darabont was a better writer/director than Gimple (and judging by the quality of the pilot episode script I read, I would say he's a fantastic writer), but for whatever reason he didn't succeed as a showrunner which seems to require a different skillset. I think for all of our valid criticisms of Gimple, he's doing an ok job overall and he's probably not getting fired anytime soon, as much as some people may want that.

    I think it's really unfair that Andy and others on the show aren't getting recognized for their acting talent, but I don't think it's because the show is actually bad. To me, an actually bad show is an unwatchable show, so if I really didn't like TWD, there is no way I would force myself to endure it.
     
  19. Danaisbestie

    Danaisbestie Rick's ride or die
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    What show maintains their highest ratings throughout the series run? If that is the measure of success, a lot of long running shows were unsuccessful because most of then hit a peak and then never reach that level again.
     
  20. TakemetoRick

    TakemetoRick Caressing Eugene's Mullet

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    I hadn't heard of the GN when the TWD show came out, but I remember thinking "This is crazy! How can they make a tv show where people are fighting zombies for years and years. How can this show possibly last more than one or two seasons and still be interesting?"

    I was so very wrong. And considering they made it to 7 seasons in spite of all of the behind-the-scenes turmoil? I think that's pretty impressive.
     
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