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Discussion/Meta They Always Come Back (Where is Davidson?)

Discussion in 'Predictions' started by Barbarossa-TWD, May 29, 2016.

  1. Barbarossa-TWD

    Barbarossa-TWD Ricktator

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    Ever since the living Walkers became more dangerous than the Walking Dead there has been a running theme that if you don't kill all those who have attacked you they come back to haunt/kill you.

    Examples:

    1. Rick didn't go after the prisoner that escaped - He came back and let Walkers into the prison again.
    2. The Governor - Michonne was right to keep looking for him after Woodbury burned. He came back and destroyed the prison.
    3. Terminus Rick wanted to end them but Glenn and the rest talked him out of it. Later, Bob was amputated and the Termites attacked the church, this time Rick learned his lesson and was waiting.
    4. Daryl should have killed Dwight who later kills Denise.
    5. Morgan and the Wolves
    6. Maggie learns and makes sure everyone who kidnapped her and Carol were killed.
    I'm sure that there are a lot more cases but all of this is to say that on their first meeting Deanna recounts Alexandria's history making sure to tell Rick about the three who left.

    S5.E12
    Deanna: For a long time, there's hardly been anyone here, living or dead, but still... we have lost people. And... I've done things.
    Rick: What have you done?
    Deanna: I exiled three men who didn't work out. And we both know that's as good as killing them.

    S5.E11
    Michonne: Why don't you have any pictures of your people?
    Aaron: Oh, I took a picture of the whole group, but I didn't get the exposure right. When I tried to develop it later, it just...
    Michonne: Did you ask him the questions?
    Rick: No.
    Michonne: How many walkers have you killed?
    Aaron: I'm sorry, what?
    Michonne: How many?
    Aaron: I don't know. A lot.
    Michonne: How many people?
    Aaron: Two.
    Michonne Why?
    Aaron: Because they tried to kill me.

    S5.E16
    Aaron: If we see them, we hang back, set up the mike, watch and listen.
    Daryl: For how long?
    Aaron: Until we know. We have to know.
    Daryl: You've sent people away?
    Aaron: Yeah.
    Daryl: What happened?
    Aaron: It was early on. It was three people. Two men and a woman. Davidson was their leader. Smart as hell, strong. I thought they'd work out. They didn't. I brought them in and I had to see them out. So me, Aiden, and Nicholas, we drove them out far... gave them a day's worth of food and water and left them.
    Daryl: They just went?
    Aaron: We had their guns. We had all the guns. I can't make that kind of mistake again.


    While writing this I just realised that Rick as Carol said when first entering ASZ "You're right even though you were wrong". I'm beginning to believe that like Hilltop not all was what it seems to be in ASZ. Hilltop conveniently forgot to tell Rick and Co about Negan recent visit. Which begs the question why was Deanna so desperate to get in reinforcements at this moment. In my post above about Deanna's videos we see that she sees a lot more than what she says. Before all hell brooke loose, Deanna became convinced that Nicolas is a liar and will do anything not only to save himself but also to attain power.

    PREDICTIONS:
    1. No! the exile(s) didn't just leave... they ALWAYS come back.
    2. Nicolas has hidden something in the pool table that Rick and Co need to find. (His son mentioned that Nicolas is overly protective of their pool table.)
    3. Someone from the outside told Nicolas where to find Rick's gun.
    4. Aaron is lying about the photo he has the photo but doesn't want Rick and Co to see who they had living there before.
    5. Just like the run with Aiden and Nicolas went wrong and they got their crew killed... I think the run to exile Davidson and his two companions went also wrong (Aiden and Nicolas aren't the most courageous) and Aaron had to kill two of them. Perhaps Nicolas had made deal with them but hadn't planned on Aaron killing two of them. (If this group had the same intelligence and experience as Rick and TF then just like Rick their first thought was to take control of ASZ - 2 men and a woman Rick, Daryl and Carol)
    6. If this Davidson is still on the outside looking in he knows he can not just waltz back in and therefore needs allies inside ::cough::Spencer::cough::
    7. Enid may not be involved in the plot but she definitely knows about it.
    So Rick needs to get ahold of Deanna's laptop, Aaron's photo and whatever Nicolas has hidden in the pool table.
     
    #1 Barbarossa-TWD, May 29, 2016
    Last edited: May 29, 2016
  2. Katbird

    Katbird Awaiting Job from Deanna

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    Yes, I was always dissatisfied with the explanation with the exile that Deanna and Aaron told TF members...did they all hear the story? I kept thinking: Naw, they didn't just leave, no way. Go back out after getting back to the quasi-normal life of old? Uhn-Uhn. I didn't hash it out like that, but I was so uneasy about that story! I just can't put aside this feeling of collusion on someone's part with those gd Saviors and Negan. Somebody ain't on the up and up...it makes for a really good story, but it is nerve wracking. And how DID Nicholas find that damn gun? October, you are so far away!
     
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  3. Barbarossa-TWD

    Barbarossa-TWD Ricktator

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    One thing I like about Rick is that not only is he muscle but he is the smartest of the bunch. Like how in a matter of minutes he had already figured out how to get into the Savior's compound by bringing them Gregory's "head"... genius. His only problem was that he believed Jesus although Jesus did tell him the truth he did not tell him the WHOLE truth.

    In the finale, Rick says very little in the RV but his face says it all. He is wracking his brain trying to figure out where he went wrong. Remember Rick was super cautious and suspicious of everything which is why he did not want to go to Alexandria in the first place.

    When they were bringing Jesus back to Hilltop and ran into the accident on the road:

    S6.E11
    Daryl: Yo, Rick. What's going on?
    Rick: We got a crash ahead. Looks like it just happened.
    Jesus: It's one of ours. (walkers snarling)
    Rick: If this is a trick, it won't end well for you.
    Jesus: My people are in trouble.
    They don't-- we don't have a lot of fighters.
    I know how it looks, but I'll play it out.
    Can I borrow a gun?
    Rick: No.

    So if Rick thinks that this was a trick he must be thinking that someone set him up. Now in the RV everyone is suspect and he is going thru his head trying to figure out what did he miss along the way.
     
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  4. Katbird

    Katbird Awaiting Job from Deanna

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    So right. Rick is hypervigilant, hyper-suspicious, hyper-masculine, hyper...I'm right there with him, trying to figure out what he let get by him. I see him turning it over in his mind as to what could have been the weak spot to make them vulerable. He wants to be a step ahead of whatever at all times, and usually is. That's why he da man...but, something is rotten in Denmark...and he missed it. I mean that in reference to Negan.
     
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  5. Barbarossa-TWD

    Barbarossa-TWD Ricktator

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  6. Katbird

    Katbird Awaiting Job from Deanna

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    We have seen THAT before! So, yeah, the unknown person seems nonthreatening at first, but, then the facade slowly, or quickly, as the case may be, crumbles and TF is, again, under threat. Rick knows that scenario all too well. "I don't take chances anymore.". Trying to determine what their "angle" is to "use you to live" (Rick's words to Deanna) makes for hypersensitivity to any thing that could pose a threat. Trusting Aaron was HUGE for TF, especially Rick. Your ideas about a situation they (TF) were not involved with or privy to makes me wonder if that dynamic is playing out with Negan's group. I know that it's a pretty obvious plot device, it's just going to be interesting to see how it plays out in S7. I know Negan has intelligence on the ASZ and, now, TF. It irks the hell outta me.
     
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  7. Barbarossa-TWD

    Barbarossa-TWD Ricktator

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    So true. Just look at Gareth's sweet face and Jesus's face and Aaron's face... hell even the Gov's face... all innocents and light.

    The only true faces we have seen were the Claimers and if you look at it they have been the most honest. If you lie you die.

    I'm still at the point where I do not believe Jesus and Aaron were malicious but they both state that they will do anything to protect their people... just like Rick.
    It is not for nothing that we had this little threesome at the beginning plotting to take over ASZ. Daryl was the most suspicious just because how he "look" but infact the ring leader was Carol "Ms. Invisible" with a kind smile to all. This is who we should be looking for in Hilltop and ASZ to find the guilty culprit is.
     
  8. Barbarossa-TWD

    Barbarossa-TWD Ricktator

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    S5.E15

    Deanna: What happens when he doesn't want to do that?

    Rick: It's not his choice.

    Deanna: So what happens?

    Rick: kill him. We kill him.

    Deanna: We don't kill people. This is civilization, Rick.

    Rick: Warning someone to stop or die, that is civilized nowadays. Oh. So what? So we just let him hit her? We let him kill her?

    Deanna: No, we exile him if it comes to that.

    Rick: We do that, we don't know when he comes back and what he does to them. Letting him go makes this place vulnerable. You really want to wait till someone in that tower has to take care of it? And that's if we're lucky.

    Deanna: We are not... executing anyone. Don't ever suggest it again. That sort of thinking doesn't belong in here.

    Rick: People die now, Deanna. They do. There's times like this you can decide who and when. Or it can be decided for you.

    Deanna: It already was. I wouldn't kill you. I'd just send you away.


    Okay so these exiles have been mentioned in FOUR episodes.
     
    #8 Barbarossa-TWD, Jun 12, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2016
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  9. Katbird

    Katbird Awaiting Job from Deanna

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    Oh, yes...I think there will be something that can be connected to Davidson--I'm not even sure the person is a man.(Men don't usually refer to women by their last names without a title, that's a guy thing, but, hey, it's the ZA.) and all that TF is currently dealing vwith. I wonder if this person was found by/found the Saviors. He/She wouldn't know about Rick's group in theory; they would know about the use of surveillance for potential community members. That is valuable information. Knowing that ASZ'ers watch, they would watch. Knowing the ASZ'ers liked to know who people were before, they would know the people there were playing a long range game, with the idea of rebuilding the larger community/world. The fact that the ASZ's leader is /was a woman, a woman who had been in the US Congress, oh, wow, they (Saviors) would see that has good/excellent intel. People say it was Daryl who set the events in motion by killing the group on the road, but wasn't it the Saviors that almost killed (shot at them) him (and Abraham and Sasha) when they were doing their part of the quarry plan? They (A and S) had to keep out of sight while waiting for (ep.Always Accountable?)Daryl...wrote his name so he could find them? I don't like the whole mess, tbh. It may turn out to be a red herring or a dropped point, idk. Knowing that the exiles are out there is very ominous, I always wondered why Rick didn't ask Deanna more about it. But, he was so skiddish about the situation they were in. It maybe the thing he missed.
     
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  10. Barbarossa-TWD

    Barbarossa-TWD Ricktator

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    I think the reason Deanna was in such a hurry to bring in "people to help them stay safe" in other words FIGHTERS is because she feared something. Aaron already admitted that he killed two people.

    Just think about it. Let's say Deanna had exiled Rick and his immediate family (Carl, Judith) after his fiasco in the town square... wouldn't there be those still in the community loyal to him because they could see that he was telling the truth? What if these previous exiles were that same as Rick and got frustrated that Deanna wasn't seeing the reality of the situation.

    Then there is this, at first I thought Spencer was talking about Rick and Co but now that I watch again he could as well be talking about the exile. I think that there is only one left since Aaron said he killed two people.


    S6.E5
    Deanna: Spencer?

    Spencer: Yeah. I-- (chuckles) My bad.

    Deanna: Are you drunk?

    Spencer: Getting there.

    Deanna: This came from the pantry. You-- you stole it?

    Spencer: I wouldn't call it that.

    Deanna: So what you told everyone... that was just bullshit?

    Spencer: No. If they all went in and raided the pantry and everyone knew it, saw it, then that would be the end.
    But one person? One person, and no one ever would know.
    So, why not me?
    I stopped that little run at the bank.
    I deserve a reward.
    One last celebration.

    Because they were right, Mom, and you know it.
    We're all gonna be dead real soon.

    Deanna: Damn it, Spencer!

    Spencer: Me? Now that is some bullshit!
    You're the reason we're so screwed.
    You made us this way.

    We were never safe here.
    But you didn't want to see that.
    You didn't want us to see that.

    You just wanted to dream.
    What happened to Dad, to Aiden, that's all you.


    There are a lot of Chekhov's Guns hints involving the exile that still have not been "fired".

    • How in the heck did Nicolas get ahold of Rick's hidden gun. Not only was it removed from the hiding place but it was rehidden OUTSIDE the gates. How did Nicolas see where Rick hid the gun since he was on gate duty when TF arrived at the gate. If Nicolas took it why didn't he just hide it in his house? I recently noticed that Nicolas climbs over the gate just like Enid. They put sticks in the holes to climb up and over.
    • Who was up stairs in the second house when Carl went sight seeing on the first day.
    • Where is Enid getting her comic books from?
    • Season five finally Spencer wants to confess something to Fr. Gabriel but was never able to.
    • Where the heck was Spencer running off to? He is not the most courageous yet he was motivated to ziplane over the heads of hundreds of walkers when he was too afraid to kill just one in the truck.
     
    #10 Barbarossa-TWD, Jun 12, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2016
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  11. Katbird

    Katbird Awaiting Job from Deanna

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    You bring up very interesting questions. I will never stop wondering how Nicholas got that gun. Nicholas was clearly under some kind of pressure, should I say, outside pressure. Those words spoken by Spencer, hmmm? Never thought about WHO he was referring to. I keep hoping Enid is not a mole/spy, I feel like Nicholas was maybe watching her and saw her stick/wall trick. She was going out all along. Maybe she saw Rick hide the gun? (She had a gun to pull on Glenn...but, they let them strap up when they go outside the walls, so maybe that's not a big deal. Could there have been two guns? I just assumed Nicholas found Rick's gun. I'm confusing myself...lol) Enid was outside watching from the burned building when Rick's group got to the ASZ. The whole thing stinks.
     
  12. Barbarossa-TWD

    Barbarossa-TWD Ricktator

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    It's the same gun because it had a "J" on it.

    This is why I insist that Enid is up to something . It may not be "bad" but she could be helping the exile. I think she brings this person food. We see a lot of open cans in the room she was hanging out in when she helped Glenn. Was it the exile who saw Glenn and notified Enid to give him water?

    Another thought I had is that the four people that Aiden and Nicolas "lost" on their run had something to do with this. It is also interesting is that one of them that turned into a walker very near Enid's hang out.

    Perhaps the exile helped Aidan and Nicolas escape by burning the feed store... the same diversion Glenn wanted to do but it was already burnt.

    I think that the toy boat with the red balloon was a signal and when Rick got into a fight with Pete someone let a red balloon float off... a distress signal perhaps?
     
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  13. Katbird

    Katbird Awaiting Job from Deanna

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    Yes to all. The time frame is really important. If the run going bad precipitated the trouble with the three they had to exile, then that would explain a lot. Especially if it was something like Rick's reaction to Noah being killed on a run with ASZ people; that sent Rick over the edge. He was done. The events could be tied together, happened in quick successions. This would account for the ASZ'ers taking a big risk, too...letting in such a big group of obvious honed /hardened fighters.
    The creatives of TWD like Scriptural/biblical references. So, it occurred to me what happened when King David had to exile his son (Davidson, the name, maybe a hint). All kinda s**t went bad after that. I won't recount the story here, but it was a real mess. David couldn't execute his son, so he exiled him. That set many events in motion. Thay do like to insert things like that in the story.
     
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