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Poll TWD Rewatch Club: Cherokee Rose 2x04

Discussion in 'Season 2' started by SevenStars, Jul 13, 2016.

?

What grade would you give episode 2x03 ?

This poll will close on Aug 13, 2019 at 6:52 PM.
  1. A

    5 vote(s)
    71.4%
  2. B

    1 vote(s)
    14.3%
  3. C

    1 vote(s)
    14.3%
  4. D

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  5. F

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. Sasha's Living Room

    Sasha's Living Room Survivor of Many Disasters

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    1.When Shane was telling his story of what happened with Otis, the camera pan to several of the characters with different looks on their faces. What do you think the writers wanted us to take away from that ?
    Yes, hard to miss! My first time watching I couldn't help assuming everyone figured out from his ridiculous story and unconvincing delivery. (Awesome job by Jon Bernthal at creating that mood along with the cinematography.) I was puzzled when folks didn't go on to act like they knew anything afterwards (especially Andrea when Shane practically confesses it to her while talking about keeping calm and shooting someone who's attacking you). On this watch, it occurred to me that we're getting a first-person perspective of what Shane is probably seeing in all of their faces. Maybe that guilty "They all know" kind of feeling was causing him to assume things.

    2. Do you think Lori meant it when she told Shane to stay and when she reiterated it again, when he tried to give her out an out ? Why do you think she did that ?

    Both times, I couldn't tell. It doesn't seem she has a clear idea what she wants (either time). I can tell you that I think she feels a lot of fear (change/disruption of the life she knows) and guilt (either for Shane or for her family) but I don't know what she actually wants for herself. Our emotions are the signposts to what we want in life, but it's hard to interpret someone else's signposts when their overall behaviour is so contradictory.

    3. Do you think Lori is pregnant for Rick or Shane?

    Don't know. The baby is more likely to be Shane's I suppose but it could still easily be Rick's. Doesn't matter to me.

    4.What do you think about how the writers wrote the women in this episodes ?

    Andrea is mainly pretty good in this ep. Not sure why Shane is still telling her she can't carry her weapon "yet" though. It's one thing to be respecting Hershel's rules but this wasn't about that. She was pretty much asking him for permission to carry her own gun. Then there's Daryl going off to search for Sophia on his own. Why couldn't Carol or Andrea come along? Andrea even went with him before??? An explanation for these discrepancies would have been nice.

    5. What did you noticed was different from the last time you view this episodes ?

    - It's interesting watching Hershel's family now that I understand why they had such a problem with firearms in a ZA.
    - Hershel's family's reactions to how Rick's group deals with walkers.
    (especially Maggie at the well-- I thought she was just grossed out the first time!)
    - Hershel telling Rick to keep his people near the house rather than letting him move them to the barn.
     
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  2. Caribbeanqueen11

    Caribbeanqueen11 Supplier of Mints
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    1.When Shane was telling his story of what happened with Otis, the camera pan to several of the characters with different looks on their faces. What do you think the writers wanted us to take away from that ?
    Both Lori and Rick looked sad IMO, but I wonder why Rick didn't pick up on the fact that Shane was lying, I'm certain he knows Shane's 'tells' but as Daryl said in a later episode he is seeing what he wants to see.

    Dale wasn't around for the drama, having just arrived right before the funeral, but the look on his face is classic. He's looking at Shane and the others like 'tha fuck, you mean this crazy ass is giving someone else credit, am I the only one smellin the bullshit?"

    I do think Shane does give the family some semblance of closure, even though he is struggling with what I believe is likely some residual feelings after his first cold-blooded murder of another human being. His talk with Andrea highlights this.

    2. Do you think Lori meant it when she told Shane to stay and when she reiterated it again, when he tried to give her out an out ? Why do you think she did that ?
    Yes I do. Lori realizes that without Shane her son would have likely died. I do feel for her in that moment because she is so obviously torn. She cares very deeply for Shane, IMO as much as she does Rick, so how can she ask this man to leave after all he's done for her and her family. I just don't think she realizes the hope she unknowingly gives/confirms to Shane.

    3. Do you think Lori is pregnant for Rick or Shane? Shane is the baby's father. I am always so surprised when this question is raised. The timeline alone made no sense. She and Shane had sex up to the morning her husband came back, she sleeps with her husband hours later. The next evening the camp is attacked, the next day (2 days later) they get to the CDC are there for one night, they flee the CDC and spend the night at the retirement home, get back on the road and encounter the herd. The next morning Carl is shot. In this episode Rick tells Hershel that Sophia's been missing for three days. A week has passed. Even if they were on the road a full day or two before encountering the heard, at the most 10 days has passed since she slept with Shane and Rick. Notwithstanding all of this the baby will be raised by Rick and I understand everyone saying Rick is the "daddy" but at this point, while Shane is alive, that is his child and if she had told them at that point (when she takes the test) they would both know it was Shane's. Waiting for a few weeks until Rick finds out makes it more difficult for either man to know conclusively.

    IMO her reaction to the pregnancy is because she realizes there is no way it's Rick's biological child and, of course, the fear of giving birth in the ZA.


    4.What do you think about how the writers wrote the women in this episodes ? (I will probably ask this question or a variation of it in every post because I noticed in the last discussion that it was hot topic when it comes to comparing the writers)
    I hate the assumption that the women need to be coddled especially when it comes to guns. I do love that Andrea pushed back more in this episode and her acting was actually really improved.

    5. What did you noticed was different from the last time you view this episodes ? ( This is a question I will asked in every episode post)
    Andrea and Shane had some chemistry going on IMO and I hadn't noticed that before.

    This is the episode that many in the media, and some fans, thought that they (FD) were starting a romantic relationship between Carol and Daryl. Also Daryl's character starts to open up and the focus starts to slowly shift to him as the 'hero' or this early on, as a sort of 'reluctant hero', but the audience began taking notice. Unfortunately, at the same time Rick's storyline did not involve much more than the love triangle, making it easier for the audience to accept Daryl as one of the main stars. Once again GM did a lot of re-writes and even considered having Shane kill Rick. GM wanted to stray from the comics so I'm not surprised if he made the decision to focus on Daryl, a character that does not exist in the comics.

    At the time the episode aired it was said that the actors had all come to the set (even those that were not filming) to see the Cherokee rose scene with NR and MMB being filmed. I thought it was a rumour since at
    that time I didn't think their acting was that stellar, but it appears that the rumour was confirmed as fact.
     
    #22 Caribbeanqueen11, Jul 17, 2016
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2016
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  3. SevenStars

    SevenStars Awaiting Job from Deanna

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    @Caribbeanqueen11,

    YES, YES TO ALL OF THIS. I think that's when the shift started happening, not only in the audience but also in the writing/production room where Daryl is concern. This is one of the main reasons I dislike the Rick/Lori/Shane triangle because I think it did a number on Rick as a character, as the lead. So much so that even now, some fans still see Rick as being a weak, and wimping leader who is faking the funk when he acts all tough and hard. That's why sometimes it feels like Rick needs to work twice as hard as Daryl in order for the audience to see him as a bad ass. This why I get why the fandom love Daryl so much and not Rick. Why some in the fandom thinks that Carol would make a better leader than Rick. It's the early days of Rick in this triangle, that fans can't seem to forget or come to term with.

    I can see why because while the acting wasn't award winning, the writing for the scene was. It was this scene that reminded me of why I used to love Daryl and how much of an interesting character he was.
     
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  4. Caribbeanqueen11

    Caribbeanqueen11 Supplier of Mints
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    I agree! while the acting was stellar, it was such a sweet moment and the dialogue was well written. This is also when I fell in love with Daryl and honestly started wondering if they were prepping him to become the lead.
     
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