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Poll TWD Rewatch Club: Pretty much dead already 2xo7

Discussion in 'Season 2' started by SevenStars, Jul 24, 2016.

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What grade would you give last episode ?

This poll will close on Aug 24, 2019 at 10:50 PM.
  1. A

    4 vote(s)
    44.4%
  2. B

    5 vote(s)
    55.6%
  3. C

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  4. D

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  5. F

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. SevenStars

    SevenStars Awaiting Job from Deanna

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    Hey guys,


    I'm sorry I put this up so late. I was planning to put this up way earlier than this but I had to go out and I was out all day until today. So how was your weekend ? This weekend as been crazy for me, too little sleep and doing way too much. I have not even been able to keep up with SDCC events and interviews. But I will tomorrow. Anyway, lets have a fruitful and fun discussion .

    1. Do you guys think Glenn did the right thing telling the group about the barn ? why?

    2. Why do you think Daryl got so mad when Carol talked about doubting that Sophia was a live ?

    3.Was there any improvement in the writing for the women ?

    4. What did you noticed this time that you didn't notice last time ?

    @Sasha's Living Room @lovingdead @Katbir @Flower1petals @Caribbeanqueen11 @MrsG@chaundee @Gooey Goobert @Canuckgirl @Jetamors
    @TexasZAgal

    I'm going to keep posting the plan for this club in every post, going forward for at least the first few weeks so that those who are joining us for the first time can get the info. For those who read it in the last post, just skip it and go to the questions.

    1. We watch two episodes per week. Wednesday and Sunday. We spend the days in between each episode discussing the episodes. So we have would have a 3 days to watch and discuss each episodes.

    2. I will try to post at least 3 questions in each new episode post but that doesn't mean that's the only thing we can discuss. If people have other comments, or questions base on the episode, they are free to post them and add them to the discussions. The questions that I be posting is just like something to break the ice, nothing more. So people don't have to feel obligated to only talk or respond to these questions. This discussion is free for all type of style as long we try to stay within the context of the episodes.

    3. The post for each episodes will be posted in the seasons thread with a poll for each episodes.
     
  2. Jetamors

    Jetamors Babysitting Judith

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    Yeah, I think it was the best decision. Though I still lol'd at Maggie's petty egg trick XD

    Followup for others: do you think Rick did the right thing in trying to persuade Hershel about the nature of the walkers? Do you think Shane did the right thing in opening the barn?

    Because he thinks she really is alive out there. Partially, because he had really been projecting himself as a child onto Sophia. He knew that children can survive situations like that, and he didn't want to write her off. The other part is that from his POV, he was getting steady trickles of promising information: the spot in the house, and the teddy bear.

    (Man, imagine Daryl meeting Clem! He'd be so impressed!)

    Weird thing I noticed this time: why did Lori bring Carl down to where Shane was ranting??? Even without knowing what was going on, it was obviously something he didn't need to be a part of. Of course, the true reason was so they could show their reactions to the barn reveal, but still, it just makes Lori look like a terrible mother. Though maybe that was the intention?

    I liked Maggie getting into different arguments with her father and with Glenn.

    Female zombie kill count update: Andrea is shown shooting at zombies from the barn, though she doesn't have any confirmed kills. This is the first time we've had a woman (presumably) killing zombies two episodes in a row.

    I was annoyed at Hershel the first time I watched this episode, but now that I know what happens next, I want to set him on fire. Even granting his wrong opinion about walkers, he *knows* there's a little girl in there! At a minimum, he should have told them that, and let Carol into the top part of the barn so she could see whether it was Sophia.

    My first time through, I wasn't paying that much attention to Daryl and Carol, but this time I also paid more attention to Caryl, and... okay, I think I'm shipping it. They were so great in these early seasons.

    Something I hadn't thought about before: did Andrea know about Lori/Shane? Her conversation with Dale makes me think that she didn't, since she didn't get any of his hints at all :(
     
  3. Katbird

    Katbird Awaiting Job from Deanna

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    One of my all-time favorite episodes. I really, really like the acting from the cast in this one. I love the writing. Of course, the ending is heart breaking. I am always sad, sad, sad when Sophia comes out of the barn. It is a difficult thing to watch all their faces...and, poor Carol. So hard to watch her desperately call Sophia, running to her. Daryl having the presence of mind to stop her--he looked so defeated. And, our beloved Rick, doing what had to be done. Bless his heart. I could see the shift of a lot of things in this episode. Shane just went into "survive" mode. I know he has detractors, as he should...he does questionable, downright, bad things. (Here comes the but.) But, he is right about fighting to survive. He is right about not pretending, facing reality. And, Rick told him about the baby!!! He flipped...he thinks that baby is his, what could he do? He doesn't have it in him to back away. Lori, what...why...but--she told him the exact wrong thing: "There's nothing you can do about it". Shane answers her with that "I don't need to". 'Cause, yeah, he made you pregnant, not Rick, duh! That is done. I think Shane was ready to kill both of them, lol. Like: "I just be damn! F**k both y'all!" He is all in for that baby.
    I saw that big shift in Glenn, staking his territory, trying his man-wings...trying it on for size. He didn't disappoint or fall short. What a great character. He has Maggie to think about now, so he let her know that and she accepted it, good. When Shane asks him: "What about you, man? You gon' protect yours? He grabbed the shotgun even though Maggie obviously didn't want him to.
    I have posted before about Maggie and Hershel's relationship. Daddy/daughter--she is a real daddy's girl. He listens to her. Hershel knows he did a good job raising her, so he listens when she challenges him, and opens his mind, then changes it. I liked that a lot. Hershel and Rick share that innate trait--being a father/husband is paramount for them both. It's more who they are than what they are.
    1.Absolutely, he did the right thing. It caused a big mess, but they needed to know. They want to stay there, they were all thinking that they were, they needed to know what Hershel thought about the walkers, that he thought they were sick. There was no other choice. Rick had to go to him with that knowledge as a part of his argument. Hershel was annoyed that Rick was in his business, but the choices had to be presented to him just the way Rick stated, there is no question about whether they are alive and Hershel needed that said out plainly. It needed to be told and Glenn did it. Good for him.
    2. I think Daryl was hurt. Here he is trying like hell to find Sophia, almost died, thinking he is doing something positive, giving them all a hope to hold on to, and Carol is resigning herself to the possibility that she will not be found or is dead. It made him mad. The words Carol said to him probably made him think he had been on a fool's errand. If her mother isn't holding on to hope, why am I doing this?--is what he is thinking. He told that story about being lost himself as a child, I'm sure it (Sophia being lost) triggered some emotions/ trauma from his past. What he really wasn't ready for, was Carol telling him that she didn't want to lose him. Boy, I bet he didn't expect that. Melissa McBride was excellent in that scene.
    3.The writing for the women not stellar in this episode, but there is so much going on. Andrea was not badly written here. She takes responsibility for herself. Her talk with Dale is good, but he is written to have knowledge/information that she doesn't. It gives me pause that she doesn't ask Dale why he doesn't like Shane or just chalks up their issues to liking or disliking each other...so she can know what the deal is. I would think an attorney would probe more, but oh, well. Lori was doing the mom thing well. Talking with Carl, trying to keep up his studies. At least, she was doing what she thought was good for Carl. I think the writers make Maggie the most fleshed out woman. She doesn't hold back what she thinks. She is open and honest. Tells it like it is, how she sees it. That is refreshing after Lori being the main woman we see, a nice change.
    4. I always liked the confrontation at the barn at the start of the episode. The Shane/Daryl thing is gold. (JB and NR must have really enjoyed that.) Lol, "methed-out", too funny. It was a group effort keeping them off of each other. I always wonder why Shane told Lori to keep her hands off him...everyone else was trying to hold him back. I hate the Shane/Dale confrontation, but JB played that sooo good. Walking right up to the end of the rifle, I get chills every time. I noticed that look of shock on Hershel's face--a man undone, world shaken. It is the worst when Sophia comes out and is turned. It hurts every time. How to you guys think she got in the barn? Did Otis really put her in there? I guess that makes sense. It's very sad, how ever she got in there.
    Looking forward to reading other posts. And I would be interested in the live re-watch, is that the right term? I'm in.
     
  4. Sasha's Living Room

    Sasha's Living Room Survivor of Many Disasters

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    Absolutely. Even Maggie understood, when she explained it. And then Rick going through the ridiculously life-threatening chore of bringing the walkers back to the barn with Hershel further underscored how futile it was to let Hershel have his way. With Lori pregnant, moving on would have been foolhardy. I'm just surprised all the gunfire at the end didn't attract more walkers.

    My best guess is that I feel like he personally identifies with the position Sophia was in, being lost in the woods. He said so himself that he'd been through the same thing. He also knew she had an abusive father just like he did. If he was able to save her, it might have helped him cope a little better with the fallout of a rotten childhood.

    Maggie is great. I believe she even convinced her father to let Rick's group stay (before the whole barn incident). Andrea would have been okay if it weren't for the bizarre infatuation with Shane.

    I could see Hershel got it *instantly* when Shane shot out that one walker's heart and lungs. Once he saw it keep coming, he didn't move and he didn't cry out for them to stop. I don't think he even tried to stop Shane from opening up the barn-- I'm pretty sure that was all Rick.

    Also, the whole time they were shooting all the barn walkers, Rick never fired a single shot! The only one he shot was walker Sophia (as everyone else was paralyzed with shock).

    As I said in the other ep, Dale already has a deathwish.
     
  5. SevenStars

    SevenStars Awaiting Job from Deanna

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    This episode was a slow one for me. I didn't love it but I enjoyed some parts of it, the Daryl/Carol Shane/Dale Maggie/Hershel and Sophia reveal.

    I thought neither Shane or Rick were right in the way they handled the barn situation. Rick was too passive about it with Herschel and Shane was too aggressive in his approach.

    1. Do you guys think Glenn did the right thing telling the group about the barn ? why?
    I think he did the right thing because the walkers are dangerous. This was something that the group needed to know for their own safety. Also, Herschel was wasting food on these dead things and I hated that. I think that annoyed me more than him actually keeping them in the barn.

    2. Why do you think Daryl got so mad when Carol talked about doubting that Sophia was a live ?
    Because Daryl see himself in the sense that when he was lost no one came to find him. He had to save himself because no one cared enough to do that. So seeing people being willing to give-up and walk away from Sophia reminded him of how it felt to be lost and abandon by those who should have come looking for him until they find him. I think the whole Sophia story was really about Daryl trying to do better for a child unlike the adults in his life as child. Daryl was doing what he wished someone had done for him, so to hear that Sophia's own mother wanted to give-up and walk way was too much for him. It reminded him of his own parents doing the some thing to him. I understood where his anger was coming from.

    3.Was there any improvement in the writing for the women ?
    Once again Maggie's the stand out among women. I appreciated the writing for her. The way she stood up to her father was great.

    4. What did you noticed this time that you didn't notice last time ?
    Herschel really annoys me.
    Shane is not sexy to me, but JB is an excellent, excellent actor who gave Shane great layers. He literally showed the break-down of Shane. In his movement, in the way he looks and talk. The Shane we met and saw in flash-backs feels like a hundred years from the Shane that was in this episode. It was like the evil twin took over. I loved it.
     
  6. SevenStars

    SevenStars Awaiting Job from Deanna

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    @Jetamors,

    Followup for others: do you think Rick did the right thing in trying to persuade Hershel about the nature of the walkers? Do you think Shane did the right thing in opening the barn?

    I think Rick was way too passive in his approach with Herschel. I get that it's his land but Herschel was being unreasonable and acting like he didn't understand what Rick or the others were trying to tell him. He wanted to live in denial because it meant that he could keep his family with him even thought they were no longer human beings. So I thought Rick should have been more blunt about the true nature of walkers and the world that is out there.

    I don't agree with Shane opening the barn because he did it in a way that wasn't safe. I get what he was saying but he took it too far. He didn't need to be that aggressive about it because like it or not, these walkers are still Herschel's love ones and people that he cared about. So him doing it the way he did, was just horrible.


    I don't think that was the intention but in this rewatch I do notice the way the writers framed it to make people question whether Lori is a good mother or not. When I first watched the series I didn't know noticed that, so I got annoyed when I would read post of people calling Lori out for being a bad mother because I thought they were just hating on Lori. But now, I think the writers wanted it that way. Lori loves Carl but is she a good mother is the way the writers seems to be framing this. So while I think your first reasoning was the main reason Lori brought Carl down there, I think this is just another point in the direction of Lori not being a great mother.

    He didn't care. He was just willing to protect his secret at any cost and I hate that. This why I don't think I will ever be a fan of Herschel. I might stop disliking him later on but I just can't with him.

    I didn't either but upon this retwatch I noticed how the writers are writing them. Which makes me question if they had every intention of putting Carol with Daryl but something got change along the way.

    I don't know but I'm thinking maybe not. Because I would expect Andrea to be looking at Lori a certain way if she did.
     
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  7. Jetamors

    Jetamors Babysitting Judith

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    I hadn't noticed that myself, that's a really good point! It also lends more support to the idea that he was holding a wrong, but reasonable opinion about walkers: he actually might not have known that they could survive what would normally be lethal violence.
     
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  8. Katbird

    Katbird Awaiting Job from Deanna

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    The follow up questions--

    I think he was right in attempting to convince Hershel to let them stay. His impassioned appeal, with Maggie's more close-to-his-heart argument, swayed him. He went to Rick with a proposal, a compromise. Rick told Hershel he was wrongheaded about the walkers. If he had not tried, Maggie's challenge would not have moved his heart.

    Shane opening the barn, yeah, that was not the right way to do it...typical Shane. He is so over the top all the time. He is exhausting. He was right about the situation, the walkers being so close and them being treated like people, but he just shattered poor Hershel and Beth. I get so aggravated with him, then I talk myself out of being pissed at him. He wanted to keep them safe, really, just Lori...Rick had just told him about Lori being pregnant and he and she had that very blunt talk about it, he told her right out he thought the baby was his. Bottaboom, bottabing--freak out. I said in my initial response, he doesn't have it in him to back away. He was 'bout to stroke out when Rick said Lori was pregnant. It blindsided him, he went off. (Kinda strange he was so startled by Rick's announcement: sex=babies. He didn't know that could/would happen?)
     
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  9. Sasha's Living Room

    Sasha's Living Room Survivor of Many Disasters

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    Of course. There was no reason for Rick not to try to reason with the guy first.

    Shane was maybe too over-the-top about it, but I think most people agree he was essentially right. Much like the waste of good chickens to feed dead people, it just bugs me that he went on to break the lock off the barn without even caring to check on Hershel's reaction to his friend (Lou, he called her in 2x08) being used as evidence when Shane shot her in the chest a few times to make his point. I was glad Shane did that, but it was extremely callous of him to just ignore Hershel and go to the barn right then.

    Interesting. I forgot to mention it, but I did find it disturbing when I saw that. It didn't occur to me that it might be intended to make her look bad, though. I've always thought she seems to be trying to do her best (much like Rick as a leader). The thing I don't like is that you see her worry and fret over bad influences and things Carl says (like 2x08's bit of foreshadowing about shooting a loved one turned walker), but she seems to insist on leaving it to Rick to talk to him about these things... and without asking Rick to do so? I thought that just meant she was sticking to her strict concept of parental roles but is that really it? And if not her, then why not ask Rick to talk to Carl?
     
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  10. Gooey Goobert

    Gooey Goobert Relocating to The Kingdom
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    1. Do you guys think Glenn did the right thing telling the group about the barn ? why?

    Absolutely. Those walkers in the barn posed a danger to their group. At the very least, Rick and his group deserve to know if there is an immediate threat. Even if they’re guest.

    2. Why do you think Daryl got so mad when Carol talked about doubting that Sophia was a live ?

    Daryl told his story to Andrea. He was out in the wild and no one came to look for him. Things are different for Sophia, but now to him his mother has given up on her. Daryl has unresolved feelings about his childhood that he still needs to work through. Carol is just realizing the strain this search has put on the group. Daryl got injured looking out for Sophia, and he’ll continue to disregard his life for Sophia. So what can Carol say in that moment? It pains her to think about it, but it’s time to consider the other possibility. But then Daryl reaffirms to her that they’ll find her. That he’s determined and wants to do it, and she hold on to that hope.

    3.Was there any improvement in the writing for the women ?

    About the same. As others have pointed out, Maggie is perhaps one of the better written woman in S2. I have a newfound appreciation for her. I love how she threw Hershel’s own words to plead her case.

    I still roll my eyes at Shane handing Carl a gun telling him to protect his mother. I actually roll my eyes anytime television shows have young boys being told to protect their mothers. Lori is a grown ass adult. I know the show doesn’t like showing it, but I am sure she is more than capable than Carl would be in regards to her own safety. I can’t believe Shane gave Andrea a hard time about having a gun.

    4. What did you noticed this time that you didn't notice last time ?

    Why didn’t Dale just share his suspicion with Andrea earlier? Yeah, she might disagree, but at least she’ll have her guard up and eyes opened. Instead he made it more about him. I’m not sure why Dale is sitting on this information. I guess he’s hoping to resolve it himself.

    I really like early days of Gleggie. I like how their stories complemented each other nicely.

    That ending scene was like a game changer. The reality begins to set in. Shane has a point but he goes about this in absolutely the wrong way, and once again demonstrates why he is no leader. I loved Jon Bernthal in that scene even though Shane was making me clench my teeth.

    I think Lori brought Carl in that scene because no else was back in the house to look after him. She kept him at a distance. But let’s be honest, even if she told him to stay put, would he? I never took this as a reflection of her parenting skill. I remember reading an interview from Mazzara on how people viewed her as a bad mother because she always lost track of Carl, and he seemed surprised. He said how he just thought it was natural just like a kid today sneaking out to go to a friend’s house and that if Carl was always under Lori’s watchful eyes then there wouldn’t be as much of a story for him.

    Though I will agree when the walkers were coming out, she should have had Carl head back, but the writing really wanted to include Carl being witness to walker Sophia and the new reality of this world. I believe it is after this episode that marks a transition in Carl.

    That ending scene with walker Sophia was haunting. Wonderfully haunting. I felt chills and a lump in my throat when I watched it play out for the first time, and I still get that feeling on this rewatch. It’s because of this scene that this episode is one of my favourites.
     
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  11. Caribbeanqueen11

    Caribbeanqueen11 Supplier of Mints
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    I love this episode and it's still one of my all time favorites.
    This is the 2nd Episode written solely by Scott Gimple, so there is no surprise the writing was so amazing.

    This is the last episode that fell under FD as a showrunner. Also, while the majority of the first half of Season 2 had a lot of GM's rewrites to FD's scripts, the rumor is that this episode stayed the truest to FD's. If you are familiar with FD's filming style even the camera work and direction were as if he was on the set and I believe it was a way of paying homage to him.


    1. Do you guys think Glenn did the right thing telling the group about the barn ? why?

    Yes, I believe he did the right thing, these people are important to him and they needed to know that there was a possible threat nearby. Despite his growing feelings for Maggie I'm glad that he recognized that her lack of understanding of the seriousness of that threat should not( and did not) influence him against telling the group.

    2. Why do you think Daryl got so mad when Carol talked about doubting that Sophia was a live ? As someone said up thread this harkens back to his past. Daryl is doing for Sophia what was never done for him. I think he alone would have understood the terror she must feel being out there, so for Carol to seemingly give up, it's as if he's staring at his own past having no one care enough to look for him and, in that moment, he is angered and disappointed that she would "abandon" Sophia.

    3.Was there any improvement in the writing for the women ? The writing was a little better, seeing Andrea sharpening the knife in the beginning and her take charge attitude when she was told to watch the barn gave us a hint of what she would have become if she hadn't been separated from the group.

    Shane giving the gun to a child to protect its mother was just ugh! Really Shane?!


    4. What did you noticed this time that you didn't notice last time ? I actually liked Dale in this episode. I know a lot of people can't stand him, but I love how intuitive he is with every member of TF. On this rewatch I realize what an asshole Hershel was being, asking that they leave even after Rick's plea and learning that Lori was pregnant, it took Maggie to convince him, which is pretty sad for a supposed man of faith.

    Other thoughts:
    Shane was trying to convince Rick to either leave for Ft. Benning or do something about the barn if they decided to stay. Shane
    made the decision to take action AFTER hearing about Lori's pregnancy - the look on his face when Rick tells him about Lori's pregnancy - you can just tell IMO that he KNOWS that baby is likely his and, as Rick said to Hershel, them out there would be a death sentence. As an aside, I wonder if in that moment Rick also knows that the baby is likely Shane's

    I believe that this the episode when Shane starts to come to the decision that Rick will need to go. He starts his conversation with Lori going back to his assumption in the beginning that Rick was dead, then he says that he wished he was "not because I thought you were mine" (which I believe is a lie), but because "he knew Rick would eventually die", then he goes into arguments, almost trying to make a case as to why Rick should have (or what he's truly saying, SHOULD) die and continues to tell Lori that Rick "ain't built for this world"; he then starts taking count of how many times Rick has saved her life (none) contrasted to him, he begins telling that he (Rick) risks his life for unimportant people "he risked his life for a drug dealer and we lost Amy..."; you see him building his case for Lori as to why Rick does not belong in this world and in essence why he (Shane) would, and should be the last man standing. This followed up with his statement that he knows the baby is his should have been a huge red flag to her that he was teetering on the edge.

    Lori's statement to Shane to this day confounds me. She first says emphatically the baby is not his, but then follows this up with "but even if it's yours, it's not gonna be yours, it's never gonna be yours and there is nothing you can do to change that!" What the ever-loving Fuck?!

    I was pissed during this scene because she made me feel sorry for Shane! LOL. Honestly though, can you imagine knowing someone is carrying your child and that person says that the child will never be yours, basically saying he had to sit back while she and Rick raise his kid. How was that supposed to work Lori?! It's not like you guys could move to different cities! On rewatch this scene, and I'm sure many others still to come, made me want to reach in the TV and bitch slap her.


    I know Shane was already on the edge, but I believe Lori's words and actions helped to push him over!

    As a side note a friend of mine had once commented that if Lori had said I know it's not yours because I had my period after the last time we were together and I've only been with Rick since', this may have pulled him back from that ledge, and at the very least his actions in trying to kill Rick would have not weighed so heavy on her. I'm not sure if this would have made Shane act any different, he was obsessed with Lori before knowing she was pregnant and had already entertained the thought of killing Rick.
     
  12. Sasha's Living Room

    Sasha's Living Room Survivor of Many Disasters

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    Totally with you @Caribbeanqueen11 except that while you've had me questioning it for a few moments now, I was (and still am) happy to hear Lori say there was nothing Shane could do to take Rick's place as the father figure for the unborn child, even if it was biologically his. I realize it's a hurtful thing for her to say and maybe she could have been more tactful about it, but it did need to be said. I mean If he'd calmed down there could certainly have been a role in the child's life for him, but unless she decided to hand custody of the child over to the guy, how was this going to be Shane's child to raise? As if he would be willing to live on his own with it as a single father, doing formula runs. I feel like Shane needed to hear exactly those words, because he probably saw the fact she was pregnant in and of itself as a sign he was "meant" to be with her, and she knew it. The truth is, Shane alone is responsible for his actions. I have no doubt even if Lori hadn't said anything, or had somehow found the exact perfect words to say, he still would have done all the same things.

    Thank you for clarifying this was the last ep FD was directly credited for working on btw. I always look forward to your comments about what was going on behind the scenes.
     
  13. Ms.J.Richonne

    Ms.J.Richonne Plotting to kill Negan
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    I am watching this episode now and I totally agree with all that you said. I knew i would find a great post from you on this episode. I was totally Team Shane in here. I loved how he proved his point shooting that walker that Hershal was holding on to. Oh and Shane looked hot as hell in this episode #sorrynotsorry
     
    #13 Ms.J.Richonne, Jan 8, 2017
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2017
  14. Katbird

    Katbird Awaiting Job from Deanna

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    Right you are, about Shane shooting both those walkers, he hit his limit when he saw them leading the walkers. The way he set that off was necessary going forward for bringing Hershel's group/family into the Ricksphere. Only Shane could have done that. Shane put all that "walkers are sick" business to rest. Hershel admits that later. Shane has no reverse, which is why, I admit, Rick is the better man/leader...he is wide open all the time. And, yeah, he is hella fine...I think impure thoughts about him.
     
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  15. Ms.J.Richonne

    Ms.J.Richonne Plotting to kill Negan
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    I'm may have to watch this episode again. ..ya know for research purposes.
     
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  16. Katbird

    Katbird Awaiting Job from Deanna

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    Of course, of course, lol! Research must be thorough.
     
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  17. Ms.J.Richonne

    Ms.J.Richonne Plotting to kill Negan
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    Lol
     
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  18. ReeciePiecey

    ReeciePiecey Nestled in Rick's Beard
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    I hated Shane in this episode lol. Overall it ended up working out but he was so disrespectful to Hershel. I'm well aware that Hershel was delusional but I can't get over the fact that Hershel and his family were just living on their property making it and some people showed up one day, refused to leave and just started making decisions about his property and what he was allowed to do in his own home.

    I think now we are very aware that our group tends to bring devastation to wherever they go. It is usually plot driven and not their fault directly but the farm situation was a clear case of them showing up, refusing to leave and deciding to take over and do what they want. Hershel wasn't keeping them there against their will. He wanted them to leave. They could have left as soon as they discovered the walkers in the barn.

    Also I felt how they cleared the barn was so unsafe. It was an anger filled, emotion-driven decision and someone could have really gotten hurt. They didn't even know how many walkers were in there. His point wasn't wrong but his execution left a lot to be desired.
     
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  19. Ms.J.Richonne

    Ms.J.Richonne Plotting to kill Negan
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    I can't disagree with you...but Shane was right in a wrong way. And he is hot. #sorry not sorry #yesiamsuperficialwhenitcomestoshane
     
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  20. lovingdead

    lovingdead The New Mrs. Grimes

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    Yes! Rick at least tried to show Herschel respect and tried to make it work his way for everyone's sake. That is what makes Rick a good man. He showed Herschel respect as a family man. The barn walkers were a threat, no doubt, but Rick was trying to figure it out and work it out as a partnership.